Has eBay put collectible prices in the tank?

dennisroberts · Joined: 05 May 2003 Posts: 3 Location: Modesto, CA

I'm doing a magazine article about the effect of eBay on the market value of collectibles. My impression, after 25 years of collecting, is that price guides are no longer relevant. Items such as comic books, trading cards and other formerly "scarce" collectibles are going dirt cheap on eBay. For instance, a "Man From U.N.C.L.E." comic that sold a few years ago for $25 is now going for $5 on eBay. This is just one example. Sports cards generally seem to go for 50 percent or less of their price guide values. Would anyone care to share their views on this?

JC · Joined: 15 Feb 2002 Posts: 217

If I've got a mint condition 1941 Widget Watchamacallit and I want to know the value of it I'm not going to look in some collectors price guide guesstimate, I'm going to look at what it sells for on eBay. Maybe some of those price guides will be collector items in the future.

There's a lot of collectors that appreciate the fact they can quickly liquidate their collection at a fair market value through eBay instead of some dealer that keeps 50% or more of the profit.

veebee · Joined: 12 Mar 2002 Posts: 359 Location: iowa

I deal in records and only use the price guide as a reference as to the year the disc was made,label variations etc. I used to do a little advertising in the Discoveries record magazine and back in those days the price guide was a pretty valuable tool as prices were pretty close to what you could get.

Since Ebay the guide is pretty much worthless as far as determining value. 100.00 RECORDS GO FOR 10.00 and some 10-20 dollar records bring in excess of 200.00 especially your soul and garage band 45s.

Sun Elvis 45s used to fetch 1,500.00-2,000.00 dollars back in pre-ebay days..now your lucky to crack the 500.00 mark.

I would say in the wide scope of things that most record prices have plummeted since the internet became a selling tool. It takes a real rare record to get decent bids on the internet.

Vaguery · Joined: 10 Mar 2003 Posts: 89 Location: Ann Arbor, MI

bladeauctions · Joined: 08 May 2003 Posts: 13

In my opinion ebay has had a major effect on the prices of collectibles. I have sold at flea markets for years and when it got to the point where i heard well i can get this on ebay for like (my cost) i was like okay i give up. I was already selling on ebay and simply closed my physical retail location to open up a website and continue selling on ebay. Luckily i can stilll compete with those giving items away because of my buying power and i tend to get much higher profit margins from my sites (3 of them) where i use pay per click advertising.

http://www.bladeauctions.com

PIoutsource · Posted: Thu May 08, 2003 5:52 pm Post subject:

yes, heck yes!
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Many online antiques and collectibles dealers have moved into fixed-price online venues. eBay is an auction venue, a hit and miss environment. Only there is no pre-auction viewing, no advance catalog distribution, in other words no organized promotion to gather up the collectors to show up when your rare item is going on the block.

As mentioned by someone in another thread, its so darn easy to list items on eBay, anybody with a camera and a computer can do it. People clearing out attics, garages, storage units don't take time to research values. They put it up for $1 and cross their fingers.

Many former eBay sellers are now buying inventory for selling in their fixed price online venues.

I believe what we are seeing is the transition from eBay to online retail fixed priced venues. Sellers are tired of competing with the junk dealers and "should we do eBay or have a Garage Sale" sellers.

There is added value at online fixed price sites to the customer for the following reasons:

1. Convenience of finding available inventory, particularly for specific items such as patterns, colors, book titles, etc. Shoppers new to internet shopping can find a rare or unusual items by searching Google and other major search engines. Or they can search all the inventory at a mall. I estimate there are over 2,500 independent sellers in antiques and collectibles at fixed price venues, and its growing every day.

2. Quality assurance guidelines (enforced at one venue) to assure items are authentic.

3. Customer service programs including return policies.

4. Shop owner names, addresses, phone numbers posted on shop's home page; buyers are not purchasing from anonymous sellers in "Anywhere USA".

5. Shill bidding, shoddy and/or mis-represented merchandise, poor packaging, no return policies and stories of fraud has made buying at eBay an uncertain event. Many customers at online malls won't buy on eBay.

I don't believe you can use eBay prices as a sole online source for values. You need to also consider selling prices of items at fixed priced venues.

Price Guides are only as good as the underlying material. What is the writer basing the valuation upon? Which auctions, where are they located, how many auctions did the writer use for their underlying database? Did the writer survey B&M dealers for realized prices in a fixed price setting?

Those are just some of my thoughts. Thanks for asking. What magazine are you writing this article for?
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sadie · Joined: 08 May 2003 Posts: 4

I've found a collectible on eBay is 3x cheaper than the same collectible at an online auction. I want to open an online auction store, and would much prefer to sell there (not eBay!) Please, all you online auctioneers, are you selling or will eBay be our undoing?

mbright1 · Posted: Sat May 10, 2003 3:19 pm Post subject:

"Many customers at online malls won't buy on eBay."

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Hi, I'm wondering how valid this statement is... might I suggest some sort of polling be done to test this... it would be of siginificant interest, to me at least... The poll would have to be displayed on a website of general interest to get a valid sampling though.

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As eBay gained in popularity, so did the depth of items being offered. And even though the buyers side of the equation also increased, the sheer number of any given item being offered simultaneously can't help but drive down prices.

I mean if a rare antique lamp typcally sold for $500 previously, on eBay today you might find 50 of them available over the course of a few months, and perhaps 2 or 3 at any given time. So what happens is folks comtemplating a bid will ask themselves, "Should I bid on the one closing today. or should I wait and bid on the one closing say 5 days from now (the one where the biddig is a mere fraction of the one closing today)."

To a certain extent, you lose a good portion of your bidders - the ones who decide to wait. And since the general populace has no idea what a particularly rare lamp might be "worth", in many cases they just compare it to the typical closing price of other anitique lamps...

A $4,000 lamp could well go for less than $1,000 - in fact it could well go for less than $100 because of its "extreme" rarity, people will tend to be even more "clueless" as to its real value, PARTICULARLY in situations where the lamp in question isn't clearly marked by the manufacturer, or otherwise described or identified by the seller.

In my humble opinion, eBay sales should be used by collectors to draw attention to their wares, and have a fixed price selling venue as well. And I don't mean a storefront on eBay either.

Items being offered in eBay storefronts, generally speaking, will never be able to garner a price higher than what a similar item may go for on their auctions. You can't do both fixed price sales and auctions uinder the same roof and expect there to be much difference.

Actually, you've created a mechanism for a downward spiral with little chance of recovery. People bidding on the auctions won't go any higher than the fixed prices, and fixed price items won't be able to go anything appreciable beyond their auction counterparts. I know there are always exceptions, but we're talking about the norm.

Is there a better solution? Sure. I keep my auction activites and fixed price sales COMPLETELY separate. I don't have any auction links etc. on my website or other storefronts, and don't do fixed price sales in any malls etc. that do try to cater to both crowds. And within my auctions etc., I have no links or other connections to my fixed price activities.

Also, ideally, eBay would put a limit on how many of a particular item is "on the block" at any given time. But thats not likely to happen consdering that they're dealing with thousands of sellers competing iwth each other - rarely will you get any sort of concensus from a group like that.

What's more, with few exceptions, I don't ever disclose the connection between the two to my customers.

I do sell at auctions, simply because they provide a mechanism for managing cashflow, the same as what offline auctions do for businesses liquidating slow moving or otherwise hard to sell merchandise.

The two most important things to consider for growth, is to turnover your inventory, and if the auctions aren't bringing the prices they should for a particular class of items, sell them elsewhere. In other words maintain and control your profit margins when you can.

A lot of merchandise in the "arts" category being a good example. You can't go into an art gallery anywhere in America and pick up a well done oil painting for less than several hundred dollars, whereas I see many attractive paintings selling for less than $100 on eBay. And no, I'm not talking about the assembly line "starving artist" paintings either.

Another area that sees inappropriate results is fine quality jewelry.

Bottom line, as always, do your homework - for some items you'll be better off selling them on th auctions, for others - you'll be better off steering clear of them.

DON'T try to mix the two together, otherwise you end up chasing your own tail(s).

To eBay's merit however, is that for the things that I do sell there, generally speaking, I will get a better price on the auctions than I might expect to get otherwise... so I guess it boils down to knowing (learning) what to sell and what not to sell there.
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kjp55 · Joined: 18 Aug 2001 Posts: 1972 Location: East of Rockies

Back in the late 80's and early 90's, I used to attend (and host) many sports card shows. It always amazed me how dealer after dealer would sit there with that spanking new Beckett Price Guide, that smirky grin on their face, and spend all day opening box after box of brand new trading cards....hoping to pull out one of those special rookie or insert cards that were so popular in those days.

I watched folks, kids and adults alike, shell out big bucks (full Beckett Guide price, for a spanking new rookie card....thinking they had just hit the jackpot. If they only knew that 90% of those cards they paid Price Guide Value for are now practically worthless. Yet, the guys sitting at the shows with the real old 1950's-70's cards couldn't get buyers unless they ran 50% off sales. Go figure??? Those are the cards that have actually gone up in value.

I guess it all depends on the market conditions, the fad of the times and the old supply & demand theory. Back to the original question, though, I have always believed that the price guides should only serve as a checklist and a reference guide. Just try getting Beckett values for most sports cards on eBay. Don't think so. Has eBay hurt the market for collectibles? Not in my opinion. It has only enhanced the visibility of the market.....to include the entire world. Instead of competing with Jo Schmo in Smalltown, USA......you're now competing with Jacque Schmo in Smalltown, France as well. If you're selling junk, unpopular or mass marketed collectibles.....you can expect to get little return for your investment. If you have something that is truly rare and there is a small market for it, you can expect to make some money. It's that simple.

Kevin_T · Joined: 03 Mar 2002 Posts: 30 Location: Australia

JC · Joined: 15 Feb 2002 Posts: 217

beerauctions · Joined: 03 Feb 2002 Posts: 3 Location: Bethlehem, PA

Being new to this board, I think I might introduce myself. My name is Lou DiDona, I am the Founder of BeerAuctions.com, and have been selling on ebay since 1997 February.

As you can tell, I specialize mainly in brewery related advertising and beer cans, as well as a varied mix of other advertising goodies.

I have seen a varied effect on a lot of types of collectibles on eBay. I still find that, on the internet side, things can get personal without even being in a room together, if you know what I mean. Two people can get into bidding wars, and prices for stuff that is basically cheap goes for decent money, as well as better items. I have also learned that the customer comes first, and promoting a friendly atmosphere in my ads and backing it up with a Guarantee, it draws people in. I have had better sales than I have ever had before, just by changing my attitude in my writing, and 0 problems with my Guarantee.

I also beleive in doing re-search before listing to try and find a better idea of what stuff is selling for, and go after that particular item.

Anyway, I have also enjoyed reading the other posts on here, and may stick around for a while and check it out!

Lou D.
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smoker303 · Joined: 11 Mar 2003 Posts: 7 Location: Indiana

I think eBay is losing percentages just like the stock market and it's decline. I try and sell a lot of very nice Fenton Glass and I've noticed since I've been selling prices are going downhill fast. How can you sell a mint item for $15-20.00 when it's worth much more? Also, eBay charges to list, charges final value on auction items, and charges to use paypal, I mean give me a break, whether buying or selling, it seems your going to come up a little more in the hole all the time until you have to stop.

Let's bring back the true reason eBay started. We need to figure some way to make it somewhat fair, as it is an auction, for everyone. you don't have to make a fortune, but a little profit would be nice!!!. I suggest using the cheapest ways to list cost effectively, don't give them any more than we have to. Should we do away with the convience of using pay pal? If you have 100 transactions a month and all use paypal, don't you lose about $200.00 ex. Let's go to m/o, cashiers checks, and personal checks, cut some of eBays profit off and put it back in our pockets!

beerauctions · Joined: 03 Feb 2002 Posts: 3 Location: Bethlehem, PA

The the exact reason why I started my own Auction site, but it's slow going. It's like David vs. Goliath. The other problem is is strictly Beer and Soda related...

If anyone does Beer Advertising or Soda/Whiskey/Bar Advertising, check it out!

Lou D.